Daring to Dream as a Child-Free Woman

Show Notes

Annie Robershaw shares her personal narrative and unveils the Dare to Dream process. Tune in to explore how to craft a self-fulfilling life, shatter societal expectations, and the importance of having a clear vision that can lead to unexpected magic.

Key takeaways from the episode:

• Why society often views child-free women as substandard

• The struggles and stereotypes faced by child-free women

• Why creating spaces for child-free women is so important

• The power of saying 'no' and setting boundaries so you can let your dreams flourish

Annie Robershaw is the founder of Delightfully Free, where she provides support for childfree women, whether by choice or by circumstance, as they Dare to Dream and create lives that honor their authentic needs and desires. She offers community and group offerings to help pave a path out of hustle culture and return to Nature's cyclical, seasonal growth model.

She is also a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist in private practice, a Certified EMDR Therapist, and an EMDRIA Approved Consultant providing support and mentorship to emerging EMDR therapists in private practice.

Noteworthy quotes from this episode:

[7:43] "[People] who are child free by choice are really asked to justify their decision over and over and over again. And that there's something about child free women that makes certain people uncomfortable. That somehow our existence isn't enough, just as it is. Like somehow we're not worthy of being, without justifying our existence by who we care for."

[32:57]"I think as a fellow people pleaser, it's revolutionary to get cozy and familiar with the word no. And when you realize, oh, actually some really great things happen when you say no is, is even more shocking when you go down that path and that the no's actually lead to more magical enhanced yeses."

Connect with Annie

Connect with Annie

Delightfully Free: ⁠https://annierobershaw.com⁠

Dare to Dream FREE Guide and Meditation: ⁠https://www.annierobershaw.com/dare-to-dream-meditation⁠

Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/delightfully_free⁠

Connect with Paige Bond

Instagram: ⁠@paigebondcoaching⁠

Facebook: ⁠@paigebondcoaching⁠

Website: ⁠https://www.paigebond.com⁠

Paige Bond hosts the Stubborn Love podcast, is a Licensed Marriage Therapist, and a Polyamory Relationship Coach. Her mission is to help people-pleasing millennials navigate non-monogamy so they can tame their jealousy and love with ease. Her own journey from feeling lonely, insecure, and jealous to feeling empowered and reassured is what fuels her passion to help other people-pleasers to conquer jealousy and embrace love.

Free Jealousy Workbook:

⁠⁠⁠http://www.paigebond.com/calm-the-chaos-jealousy-workbook-download⁠⁠⁠

Free People Pleasing Workbook:

⁠⁠⁠https://www.paigebond.com/people-pleasing-workbook⁠⁠⁠

Disclaimer: This podcast and communication through our email are not meant to serve as professional advice or therapy. If you are in need of mental health support, you are encouraged to connect with a licensed mental health professional to receive the support needed.

Mental Health Resources: National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 1-800-273-8255SAMHSA’s National Helpline: 1-800-662-HELP (4357)Crisis Text Line: Text HOME to 741741 for free, 24/7 crisis counseling.

Intro music by Coma-Media on ⁠⁠pixabay.com⁠

Transcript

(generated by AI - please excuse errors)

[00:00:00] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: School didn't teach us how to be good at love, so I created the Stubborn Love Podcast to help you navigate it. With my expertise in the marriage therapy biz, I'll share insights on topics like sex, money, and rock and ro Um, I mean, navigating conflict and more. No matter what stage of relationship you're in right now, this podcast is for you.

Every episode has actionable tips that will help you create a happier, healthier, and more fulfilling life with the people you love. Don't miss an episode, subscribe now, and join me on this journey of love and learning for the stuff they didn't teach you in relationship school.

Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Stubborn Love. Today I am joined by the lovely, lovely Annie Robershaw, and she helps child free women create delightfully free and fulfilling lives. She's also, you know, a licensed psychotherapist in Washington and California and certified to provide EMDR.

Um, and now she's working on a really cool project with Child Free Women. So Annie, thank you so much for being on the show today. I'm so happy you're here. Oh,

[00:01:18] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: I was so excited to be here with you, Paige, and take our, our, our conversations live.

[00:01:24] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: I know we have so many behind the scenes conversations, and I feel like I get to have an inside look on this, you know, big project that you're working on helping child free women.

so I know you are a well seasoned therapist, but today we're here to talk about your big project. So can you talk about what got you started on being able to be like this? really big voice in the world of wanting child free women to create these beautifully designed lives.

[00:01:53] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Well, it's, it's definitely been a journey.

I think becoming child free myself was just an experience. And so often the experiences that we have in our life just feel so familiar to us. We don't really see them. as unique or different. It was just something I survived and figured out how to make a life for myself, um, often the hard way after realizing I wasn't going to have kids.

after about 10 years of being a therapist, maybe more, I had an experience where I was supporting a client who, um, And this was not the first time I experienced this, who said, you don't know, you don't have kids. And that was just like, I, I took a step back and after the session, I was like, gosh, that is something else.

It just, you know, total compassion for where she was coming from. But just like, wow, the way I just sat with it. And I had a conversation with my mentor and coach, and I was like, this is such a thing, you know, to kind of attack women for not having children and that somehow we don't know. And I've served a lot of clients through many painful moments in their life.

And many of those experiences I have not shared with them. And I have to say the only time I've ever been called out for not having a shared experience, and that somehow would mean that I wouldn't be fit to serve them is by moms. And it got me thinking about this experience of being child free and what it's like to be kind of pegged as like not capable of having empathy or understanding not getting it, um, for our mother, friends and sisters and all the people in our life.

And it just kind of started from there. I was like, this is actually a lived experience that deserves to be seen and heard and not ostracized. So that's how it got started. And as I started to go from there, I'm like, how did I create this life? And I found just all these juicy insights. I'm like, there's something here.

and that's special and unique. And I really love my child free life now, even though I didn't choose it for myself. And that's how it got started.

[00:04:09] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: You know, when you talk about how this kind of bloomed out of not wanting to have a place where people may be in, like, your similar situation and feeling exiled or ostracized from a group of people, I really love, like, how this idea was born out of wanting to make people feel like Like they did belong.

[00:04:32] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah. I think once I started to really think about it, I recognize how often I have to justify my lived experience, or not that I did, that I'm put in a position to. And I started to talk to my husband about it and some of my friends that are child free and, and, started to recognize this is an experience that other child free women have where we're consistently asked, do you have children?

And, how often? And my husband and I would usually laugh about it because people, just even strangers, like we'd be at a restaurant and people would be chatting with us and they'd say, do you have kids? And you're like, gosh, you know, I'm just out trying to have a good time. I don't want to have to justify my trauma history or my procreation history.

And typically I'll say, no, we weren't able to. And I I'm, I'm not kidding you. Almost every time somebody will say to me, oh, that's too bad. Did you ever consider adoption? Like, yeah, I'd be like, do you, you know? It's just, it's just so bonkers. So my husband has started to say, no, what's that? And, or have you, um, you know, for some reason, like child free women have to justify why they haven't gone certain pathways and not to say that we hadn't considered that, but it's just so curious that people feel the need to really dive in to your history, even when you've let them know, like, hey, there might be some trauma around this. and even if you are child free by choice, you shouldn't have to justify that to anybody. And so as I started to talk to people about this, I was just struck by how alienated and in the shadows child free women often feel.

And it hadn't occurred to me because I was just doing it. And I was like, Oh man, we, we need a space. And I started to Google and look for spaces and opportunities and retreats. And you know, there's a million things for moms, but I wasn't really finding much of anything for childfree women. I was like, gosh, I, I really could have used a space when I was realizing I was

it's gonna be child free and there was nothing. There was no one. And so that's, that's why I was like, I'm gonna create this 'cause I'm gonna be what I need and create what I needed and, and wasn't available for me.

[00:06:50] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah. Yeah. And I can totally see, and I've had an experience where I'll share, Hey, no, I choose and don't want to have kids, and I'll be met with, yeah, sure.

Okay. And then the follow up as, you know, some idealistic dream where I do end up having, like, these grandbabies for, you know, a parent or something like that, and I'm like, wait a second, I thought you were supportive of me and just agreed that, like, we were on the same page that I'm not having kids and I don't want to, and so it's almost like you also have to prove yourself, like, even more so, like, no, this is not happening, like, My life is going in a different direction.

So do you find that that was also something that you had to overcome with trying to like almost convince people or let them know, like you're on a different path?

[00:07:43] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Absolutely. You know, across the board from people intimately close to me to strangers in a waiting area at a Mexican food restaurant over cocktails.

So it, yes. And I've really heard a lot from my friends and clients and other people that I know who are child free by choice that they're really asked to justify their decision over and over and over again. And that there's something about child free women that makes certain people uncomfortable.

That somehow our existence isn't enough, just as it is. Like we're, like somehow we're not worthy of being, um, without justifying our existence by who we care for. Who we've birthed, who we've adopted, whether we have a pet, whether we're a good auntie or like, I don't know what that is. Well, I do know it's the patriarchy, but, um, I, I just find it very curious that women are consistently put on the spot to justify our existence.

And I really want to, and I'm in the process of creating spaces where nobody has to justify their existence. Not by what they do, not by who they birth, not by who they adopt. you exist, you are worthy. And you get to come and be and explore a life that you love. It seems like a, a thing that we should all have, whether you're childfree or not.

[00:09:10] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah, bare minimum, right?

[00:09:12] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Bare minimum. You, you matter just as you are, bare minimum. Um, it doesn't seem so controversial, but it's something most of us struggle with and, and struggle with in the way that we relate to one another.. Asking each other to justify our existence. It's not okay.

[00:09:32] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: And I want to get to, um, you know, talking a little bit about like you creating the space for that. But first I want to ask why do you think it is that there's such a lack of these spaces for child free women by circumstance or choice? Like why don't you think there's groups out there or retreats out there specifically made for these people as often?

[00:09:56] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Well, I think that historically being child free has been considered a substandard existence, not something to celebrate or create spaces for. You know, I'm really like if you look around Google's in your community opportunities to gather with other moms and there'll be endless opportunities and and that's a good thing because being a mom is the most significant role you can play in the society as far as I'm concerned, and it's a very difficult one at this time.

So that is really powerful, but it. But it's curious to me that there's all these other women out there that also need space to belong and have relatable spaces and experiences where we're not having to justify ourselves and it's just not there. So, you know, when I was going through infertility in my twenties, there was nobody around me that was child free.

the ones that were, were planning to have kids are in the process of having kids. In fact, I'm the only person in my family including my cousins who didn't have a child. And I'm probably the one that everyone thought most would have one. So three generations. That was pretty shocking to realize when I was going through that.

So there was just like no one to turn to. There was no one in my life that was like, Hey, like, there's this whole other way of life. That's also a great option. Um, that was not presented to me as a child. It wasn't presented to me when I was going through infertility. It was presented to me like your life is a pity.

in so many ways it was coming from a place of love and compassion because I was going through a painful loss in my infertility. It wasn't by choice, but I, what I got was pity and that like, it was something that I had to get, go through, get over and accommodate. It wasn't presented to me as like, yeah, this sucks, but hey, there's this whole other world available to you and life opportunities available to you now that are pretty awesome and exciting too.

I mean, I just think the reason why that doesn't exist is because we expect women to have children.

[00:12:03] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah. That is the expectation.

[00:12:06] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: It is.

[00:12:07] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: So you decided to create these spaces since you couldn't really find anything to have like belonging or support going through all of that.

Can you talk a little bit more about that journey of like going on that creation phase?

[00:12:24] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah, I started to think about how did I get through that? And, um, how did I cultivate this life that is pretty dreamy, that I love so much, and that I was just really sitting like, how did, like, what did I do?

And, um, on the other side of grieving, of course, and, you know, just kind of the, uh, crumbling of the life I knew, I really started to imagine, I, I actually had this pivotal moment when My last infertility treatment failed and I was just like, if I'm not going to be a mom, who am I going to be? And it was this, it was this very painful crescendo moment.

And it speaks a lot to how much my identity was wrapped up in the idea of being a mom and had been my entire life. And that moment just broke everything open and I had to really sit with that. With, you know, who was I going to be? And it was a long process that's still unfolding and will unfold for the rest of my life, truly.

But slowly, but surely I started to imagine, I started to kind of look at my life. What did I love? What was speaking to me? What lit me up and how could I lean into that and do more of that? And so it kind of became a detective process of finding and reclaiming and developing aspects of myself that mattered.

And I ended up finishing my education and finding pieces of myself there and really considering where did I want to live? What type of people did I want to be around? What was community going to mean to me? What were traditions going to mean to me? And the process of dreaming and imagining my life led me to start to forge a path to cultivating that.

And it was pretty exciting. And, you know, as I moved out of the pain and the grief, my life just started to open up and magic started to happen. And every step I took a new adventure, I took a new relationship. I had taught me something about myself and enhanced. The vision of my life moving forward and what resources I needed to make that dream a reality.

And, and on I went and it's just led to the most incredible experiences and relationships. And each time I kind of update that template and I'm like, okay, what have I learned about myself? What have I learned about life? What have I learned about what I love and lights me up? And what does that tell me about what I want for my future?

And then I start to carve out. Um, my vision for the next steps of my life with that information and I realized there was something really meaty about how I got through this I hadn't really appreciated and that that process has been a part of my therapist journey and that I've like implicitly been applying this journey with my therapy clients over the years but I hadn't really identified it was just so much a part of myself and so much a part of the way I live life that I kind of took it for granted and so I started to Really look at this process of how I live my life and I realized this, this is something, um, and it actually helps insulate me from all the messages in society that tell me this is the way, this is what you're supposed to be, this is how you're supposed to live your life and it, I mean, I'm distracted by all those things too, but it helps me to come back to like, no, what, what do I actually want?

. So that became the template and I now call it the dare to dream process that became a part of what I'm creating in delightfully free for child free women is that having a sense of who you are and what you want and where you want to go becomes really important in a world that tells you that you're less than or not worthy or not valuable because you don't have kids like it becomes even more important to dream and cultivate a life that feels delightfully yours and delightfully free.

[00:16:15] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: ,Chef's kiss. So, taking all that in, it sounds like this isn't necessarily of like, oh, what goals do you have? Or, oh, what do you want to accomplish? It's more about like, really dreaming and leaning into this idea of the best life you could live for yourself and just start embodying what that would be like, is that what happens?

[00:16:46] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah, I mean, goals are important. Um, but it's also really important to ask why, why do I want that goal? Is that, is that actually mine? Or is that what I think I'm supposed to be doing?. so I think that's a really important part of the process is like kind of diving in and getting to know yourself and being asking like this thing that I think that I want that I'm heading towards is, is this really My embodied vision for my life.

When I smell it, when I taste it, when I feel it, when I imagine myself there, what is that like for me? And I've noticed over the course of serving countless people in my therapy practice is that very often a people don't know really what they want or if they do, they haven't really considered why.

And when we really start to unpack that, we find some really interesting things. And when people actually have a vision for their life, that's. Authentically, there's something really compelling happens. It's really about getting to know yourself, getting to know what life has taught you already and starting to unpack that and seeing where your imagination takes you.

As you do that, and sometimes that's noticing what you really love and like, and what feels good to you, what smells are great to you, you know, do you like being in nature? Do you like being cozied up in the couch? Or both in my case. , what people, when you're around them light you up and make you feel like most yourself and most energized. And also what doesn't feel good?

Where have you been? What relationships have you been in? What jobs have you done? What paths have you taken that really just didn't feel good? And what was it about it that did not feel good to you? And what do you want instead? I have found that so often the things that have hurt or been the most uncomfortable to me, including relationships have taught me the most about what I actually want and need.

When I really take the time to unpack them and not just avoid the pain that they provided. So I love to take people on that journey of their lived experience. And it's just amazing what emerges. and so often the vision is there, but a lot of times people have shelved it or, or shoved it under a rug because they don't believe it's possible or it's scary to dream it, or they just really haven't had time to dance with that vision or that dream.

[00:19:05] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah, those last few things that I think happen quite too often like either they don't make the space to be able to dream They don't think it is possible to make the space like maybe given their life circumstance currently. It sounds like you carve that out For these people that you're working with to create that with them.

[Annie Robershaw]

[00:19:28] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: It's essential. It's essential I mean we are marketed to all day long every day all types of people and corporations telling us what we should want, what we should need, what we should buy, what we should do, what peak we should bag, whatever it may be, it's just this consistent, drumpy, it's really hard.

Um, not to mention your culture, your family, wherever you're, you're relating to people, you're getting messages from everywhere, what people want you to be and what they want you to buy. And it's really hard to carve out space and quiet the noise and all the messages you're getting and really get inside and be like, what am I about?

What do I want? What do I need? And creating space for that is essential to cultivating a life that actually feels like yours. Because I find that people sometimes get everything they wanted and it feels terrible to them and they find themselves in therapy just totally confused. Like, I got all the things I ever dreamed of and I feel miserable.

Why? Help me. And usually what we find is the vision that they had wasn't actually theirs.

[00:20:33] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Living someone else's life or dream.

[00:20:35] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah. that's a painful place to find yourself in. And as much as I can help people find the vision that's theirs and start to find their way on that path to making that vision a reality, that's really authentically theirs, that they can keep the parts of culture and family and life that, that ring true to them.

And, but put aside the things that aren't theirs. It's hard work, but it's worth it. And it, the pain of like unraveling it down the road is sometimes much harder than the realization right now on the journey about what you want.

[00:21:11] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah. So who would be a good fit to go on this journey? And who would not be a good fit

[00:21:18] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah. Well, if, if you're someone who identifies as a child free woman, whether by choice or by circumstance, and you are at peace or in relative peace with your child free status, meaning like if you're in acute pain around being child free I would say this probably wouldn't be the next best step.

There's probably some work to do to unpack and heal from that pain before we get on the Dare to Dream journey. It's good to start to think about the vision, but there's usually some work to be done around that healing. But if, if you're pretty clear that the child free path is, is the path that you're taking and There's some aspects of your life that you don't feel at home in, and you're ready to explore why that might be and where do you want to go next.

This is the space for you. Also, if, if what you would like to have is intimate relationships with awesome women that inspire you and support you and encourage you as you embark on your journey, then I want to welcome you in to this space. Like, I really want to cultivate space for child free women to not have to answer, do you have kids and have other people in their life that are child free doing cool things and, and being brave and courageous with their lives to inspire one another.

Cause that's not something that I had when I realized I was going to be child free. So I really want to make sure. That all women know that being child free is not something to be pitied. There's so much, so much about this, this opportunity in life that comes with being child free.

That's pretty magical. And I love my life. I would have never chose this life, but now I wouldn't change it, you know? And I think it would have been a lot easier path if I'd had other women on the path with me earlier on. So yeah.

[00:23:11] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: It sounds like, um, a big unique part of what you're creating here in the Dare to Dream process is really like creating community, helping people feel less alone in this process, helping people feel like they have a team of other women, you know, cheering them on in creating the life that they want.

I know that I've gone through your process of Dare to Dream, so lucky to have been able to, like, been helped create that, and I, I love all of it, and I know a lot about the whole framework, but for listeners, can you tell them, kind of like a preview of what they would be going through in particular to go through this process of Dare to Dream?

[00:23:55] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah, so I have a six week offering coming up for eight people, it'll be two small groups of four. So the first step will be meeting with me individually after you do a little bit of pre work and we've discussed some of it, where you're starting to kind of unpack like, what do you know that you want and what do you know that you don't want and what do you want instead?

And then. We would put our heads together and start to look at what you're finding and identify what area or area of your life that you want to embark on a new journey for. Sometimes that's in relationship it might be in community, it might be in your purpose or employment. There's lots of journeys in our life.

And sometimes there's some combination. We'll identify, like, where do you want to focus on for this part of your Dare to Dream journey? Then we'll have six group sessions where we'll start the process of identifying, unpacking what you want together in a group so everybody can start to kind of vibe off of each other and experience each other's ideas and support one another.

And along the process, and we start to look at, okay, what resources do you need and which resources do you already have? So when you start to identify what you want, like for me, one of my dreams was to move to Bellingham, Washington for so long. And really having to look at like, what did we need to make that dream a reality?

And what did we already have? And that, that helped to focus the journey. And part of it was finances. So a lot of times we're talking about finances and those types of resources, but it might also be connections, it might be housing, that type of thing, it runs the gamut. And then the next step is what are the roadblocks that you foresee that you already know are there or that you might foresee.

So again, that might be more practical things like, um, I, I don't have the money to, to do that dream or I don't have the education or whatever it might be, but it also might be things like, I don't believe that I'm capable of doing that. Or I might have fears about that. And so there's all types of roadblocks that get in the way of us streaming or taking steps on our dreams.

So we really dive in and explore what those might be and what resources or steps might be taken to alleviate those roadblocks or move over them or around them, um, however, it might be that that would serve you best. And as we go through that process, we, we kind of create a roadmap and a resource list and all the things that need to happen that support you.

And it just really starts. to become clear, okay, here's how I can make that dream a reality. And the end of the process is really coming into this embodied vision that I talk about where you can smell it, you can taste it. You can feel the emotions. You can see who's there. You can feel them there.

You see where you are and you really kind of get into the somatic experience of that dream coming true. So that it is so compelling and it feels so true to you, that it drives the motivation and the effort to make that dream a reality. When you really can feel it and taste it, it does become empowering and it really helps you on those days where you feel fearful or unsure or there's hard work to be done to make that dream a reality.

It helps you to traverse that path. Um, so we wrap up with that and share each other's visions and hopefully support each other along the way.

[00:27:18] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Mm. Beautiful. And it sounds like, you know, by the end, even if the work starts getting hard, there's that internal motivator of that vision of your life really keeping you on the path of going forward towards it still.

[00:27:33] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Yeah.

Yeah. Like, I think one of the things. Just as for an example, the dream of having a home in Bellingham, there was a time where that just really felt so farfetched. And as we watched housing prices go up and, you know, there were so many hurdles to making that dream a reality, but on a day to day basis and a month to month and year to year basis, we made really significant life choices that were cultivating that possibility.

Creating the possibility of that being an opportunity in our future. And it actually ended up happening sooner than we thought. But, um, you know, sometimes you're making choices that feel like sacrifice, but they, they're not as hard to make when there's something that you can grab onto that feels so compelling or like this choice, that's maybe a little bit uncomfortable, like living in basement and 10 years.

You know, not ideal, but let's make the best out of it because someday there's something in our future that feels, um, So compelling that this makes it worth it to be a little bit uncomfortable now, or, you know, maybe around our spending or education or opportunities, whatever you're doing, you're like, this is all moving in a particular direction.

And rather just than random acts of getting through the day.

[00:28:51] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah. It's in service of that vision.

[00:28:54] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Exactly. Exactly. And, you know, for me, I, I practice the dare to dream around relationship too. I found that when I was newly single after a divorce, really like drawn into every shiny person that came along, like, I just love people and I see the possibility and potential in people.

So I was just like, Ooh, look over here, look over here, look over here. And that led to a lot of exhaustion and pain. Let's just be real, because I would see the pieces of what I wanted, or just be excited in the moment and then I'd go down a path when really, if I'd been clear about what I wanted, and what the dream was for me in relationship and in life, like this would be somebody I'd maybe have some laughs with at a party and move on with my life, right?

And so when I got very clear about what I wanted. And who I wanted, and how I wanted that to feel, and what I wanted that to look like, and like, had my values embedded in that. It got really easy to be like, yeah, you're shiny, but you're not for me. And opened up a lot of energy and space for me to cultivate a life I loved that led me to someone I wanted to share it with.

But it was really hard for me not to be distracted by all the shiny twinkly things that crossed my path and I would be like, oh, I, you know, I was always like lost in the woods with the next person that came along and I'd be like, where am I? How do I get out of here? How do I get back on the trail?

I'd be like popping my little tent, emergency tent in the woods. Um, hungry and cold. so yeah, I, I think having that clarity and updating it regularly as life teaches you more about yourself is just key.

[00:30:42] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: And I hear maybe a theme, you tell me if I'm wrong here, but a big part of this is like boundaries. Like your own boundaries of respecting yourself, respecting what dream that you want to go towards and letting people know around you, like in your circle, what that is. And so like, you can kind of put like this protection around this vision that you're going towards. Does that line up?

[00:31:09] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Absolutely. And it's so interesting that you say that because One of my epiphanies along the journey was this was something that I was inherently doing for other people. like I love to champion other people's dreams. I love, I love supporting and witnessing people's dreams come true, but very often I wasn't I wasn't connected to my dreams. I was still playing the script or trying to please be a people pleaser, Paige. Um, and when I realized how powerful this urge was to champion other people's dreams, I was like, gosh, maybe I could do this for myself. And I realized I had been, but I wasn't always being accountable to my dreams in certain aspects.

And so the more clear I got about it, yes, it was about boundaries because there's always, every time you say yes to something, there's a no inherent in that. And I wasn't always being accountable. I was just like, yes, yes. Going around saying, yes, this is exciting. And then being very confused about the no's that were backslapping me and the messes that came with them. Realizing that, which is, is, a very essentialist mindset was very powerful for me. So yeah, it is about boundaries and also being accountable that you only get one pie of experience here and energy and how you cut that is really important.

[00:32:33] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Mm hmm. I really have been myself practicing the power of no lately, and it's really interesting how many more opportunities actually arise from that no, rather than saying yes and being swamped with whatever task or project or opportunity the yes would have brought. The no actually seems like it flourishes more and is like energy giving to me as well.

[00:32:57] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Oh, so much, so much. I think as a fellow people pleaser, it's revolutionary to get, like, cozy and familiar with the word no. Yeah. And when you realize, like, oh, actually some really great things happen when you say no is, is even more shocking when you go down that path. Um, and that the no's actually lead to more magical enhanced yeses.

[00:33:25] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah, because then you get to put in all of your energy into that yes, rather it being half hearted yes to something that you're like, so sure, but I guess I'll do it. Or I guess they'll be happy that I said yes to this. Now all that reserved energy from all the no's you give gets to go into that full big yes.

[00:33:46] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Absolutely. Absolutely. And I also realized that there were some really clear yeses in my life. For instance, I remember once I saw a psychic and with one of my best friends and we sat down and she, you know, she did numerology and all those things and she got my name and my numbers and she did her little decoding and she looked up at me and she's like, well, aren't you just the mothership? Everybody wants to land on you, don't they? And my best friend was like next to me, just like belly laughing. And it was actually like one of the questions I was going was like, why am I so depleted all the time?

And, I had to go through a real process of realizing, like, I love people. And I just love them. I love everything about them, but there's only so much of me to go around, especially as a highly sensitive person. And when I was saying yes to every person I met for every coffee date, for every lunch, for every phone call, for every friendship, that I was inherently diminishing the yes for the people that matter most to me in my life.

And so I, I didn't understand until way down the road that, that yeses over here actually meant less for the yeses that matter to you most. And that by saying no, sometimes I'm reaffirming that these yeses really matter to me and I feel like the dare to dream process really helps me with that. It really helps me get clear and I have to keep coming back to it over and over again because life is really exciting and it's full of opportunities that are very exciting to me but you have to choose and it's not true that you can have it all.

And when you try, it actually diminishes the quality of what you do have. And so, sometimes it's really hard to say no, especially to someone new and exciting. But then I think about especially my friends or my partner. Like, those relationships, or my family for that matter, are so delicious and fulfilling to me that I have to really think if I say yes to this, what am I going to miss out there, on there, right? And that has, like, revolutionized my life. Everything keeps getting better and better the more I get clear about my yeses and noes, even when it's hard. And the better life gets, the, the harder the noes are because the better the opportunities get.

You get more and more opportunities that are really exciting at a different time in your life you couldn't believe that you would ever think about saying no to, but that's the beauty of, like, going down this path. It's like your opportunities get better, but it is, it's hard to say no.

[00:36:08] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah. Oh, wise words from Annie Robershaw, folks.

Well, thank you so much for really going into the beauty of your Dare to Dream process. I really hope that listeners are taking some nuggets of wisdom about, you know, where they might be able to find community or if they want to look into your program and get connected with individuals there that share their same things that they may be going through.

Are there any other things that listeners should be looking out for or that you just want to leave the listeners with today?

[00:36:47] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: I think for anybody who identifies as a child free woman, I want you to know that there are other child free women out there that are excited to share the path with you and inspire.

And in no way is this about alienating ourselves from, the women in our life who are parents because we love them too. Some of the people in my life that have made the biggest difference are mothers and close friends. And I, I, those relationships are so pivotal and powerful for me. So this isn't about like a sectioning off over here.

It's just creating space for what's unique about our experience and sharing that together and supporting one another. And I really, truly believe that when we look out for one another, we rise the experience up for all people. And so I think that's just really important. to put that out there is, this is about all women having value inherently, no matter what path they choose around parenthood or life in general.

I think the other thing. There's definitely things coming down the pike, you know, in, uh, 2024, there's going to be more opportunities and I put out a newsletter every week and it's more kind of storytelling. And just me sharing insights and experiences from the child of free women perspective.

And so if you're interested and you want to check it out and see if the vibe feels like your vibe, I think that would be a great place to start. my website right now is AnnieRobershaw.Com. yeah, I think we'll be diving into some things like digital essentialism, um, liberating yourself from, uh, all the noise out there so you can dream and live the life you want.

One of the themes that we'll also be looking at around resources is financial freedom and cultivating a few money and different things like this. So there'll be some real practical, pragmatic pieces coming in 2024 to kind of support you and making your dreams a reality. So stay tuned for that.

[00:38:46] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Hmm. Beautiful. listeners I'll have all of Annie's links in the show notes, so you can hop on her email list. I highly suggest it. Um, it's hilarious. It's heartwarming and it is just some damn good storytelling that you do, Annie. So thank you so much for sending out your emails.

[00:39:04] Annie Robershaw, LMFT, Founder of Delightfully Free: Thank you so much. It's fun.

[00:39:06] Paige Bond, Relational Psychotherapist: Yeah. Good, good. All right. Well, uh, that is it for the show today until next time. Thank you.