Unlocking the Enneagram and Building Lasting Relationships
Summary
How can knowing your personality type build a lasting connection?
Natalia Hernandez is a Certified Enneagram + Relationship Coach. After years of living in victimhood and a string of failed relationships in her intimate relationships, Natalia knows what it takes to have a strong, fun, 5-star marriage. She now shares her experience and expertise with others.
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Main Points from the Show:
Natalia Hernandez discusses the importance of understanding personality types and its significance in relationships. She shares three pillars to promote happy relationships. The enneagram personality assessment is explored, and the importance of not assuming the first result is emphasized.
Connect with Natalia
Website- nofrillscoach.com
IG - https://www.instagram.com/nataliahernandezcoaching/
Enneagram In Love Podcast - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/enneagram-in-love/id1529623401
Free Guide to Communicate Better + Argue Less:
https://view.flodesk.com/pages/63d04b6dde520bd60dc33966
Connect with Paige Bond
Instagram: @paigebondcoaching
Facebook: @paigebondcoaching
Website: www.paigebond.com
Paige Bond hosts the Stubborn Love podcast, is a Licensed Marriage Therapist, and is a Polyamory Relationship Coach. Her mission is to help people-pleasing millennials navigate non-monogamy so they can tame their jealousy and love with ease. Her own journey from feeling lonely, insecure, and jealous to feeling empowered and reassured is what fuels her passion to help other people-pleasers to conquer jealousy and embrace love.
Free Jealousy Workbook:
http://www.paigebond.com/calm-the-chaos-jealousy-workbook-download
Free People Pleasing Workbook:
https://www.paigebond.com/people-pleasing-workbook
Disclaimer: This podcast and communication through our email are not meant to serve as professional advice or therapy. If you are in need of mental health support, you are encouraged to connect with a licensed mental health professional to receive the support needed.
Mental Health Resources:National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 1-800-273-8255SAMHSA’s National Helpline: 1-800-662-HELP (4357)Crisis Text Line: Text HOME to 741741 for free, 24/7 crisis counseling.
Intro music by Coma-Media on pixabay.com
Transcript
Please note that this transcript was generated with AI and there will be errors.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Hello listeners. Welcome back to another episode of Stubborn Love. We have another guest today and her name is Natalia Hernandez and she's a certified Engram coach and relationship coach. So boom, imagine having all of the information of learning your inner self with identifying your aio gram and then working on your relationship, you got a two for one for her. This is going to be such a great conversation today that we're going to talk about she's got three pillars for any
happy relationship. And so I'm so excited to dive into this topic of her relationship trifecta. So Natalia, before we dive into our topic today, can you kind of introduce yourself to listeners and talk about your journey to how you got to be this type of coach for your clients?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Of course, thank you so much for having me, by the way, Paige. So I am Yep. Natalia Hernandez certified Anagram relationship coach. I got started with this a couple of years ago when someone randomly, I had met a friend on social media and she randomly asked me, hey, are you an anagram type seven? And I was like, what are you talking about what?
I don't even know what that is and she's like, what you have to go and get your anagram personality assessment done. And I thought, ok, so I went and I got it done and I read through the options and it was like a lightning bolt that had struck me in a way that I never felt before. It described me down to A T and this isn't like the engram isn't something that is like the horoscope or that is some kind of like silly quiz online to tell you your, the fun things about yourself.
The engram is actually challenging to know about yourself. The main thing that it showed me that then it o like I got flooded with these memories of my past relationships and this is what led me into relationship coaching. The biggest thing that it told me about myself as a type seven was that type sevens have a fear of being in pain, not physical pain, but of like feeling sad and anger and disappointment.
Like people feel those feelings every day, but for a seven, they're intense and he described it in a way that I was never able to articulate for myself, which is like we feel we fear that we're gonna be sitting in this pain forever. Like I can't handle being mad because then I'm, I'm gonna be mad forever. I'm gonna blow up or sadness like I can't handle feeling sad because it'll just take over me, it'll consume me.
That's the fear that I had. So, when you think about relationships, one that I had been in and it's just so sad to talk about now. But, you know, looking back all the past relationships I had been in, I left, I left every single relationship I was in because the moment it got a little rocky, I was like, oh, I'm out of here, I'm out of here. Like I can't.
Nope, nope, nope, can't handle it. Can't deal with this. No, no, I'm gone. And I would leave in also just the worst way in the kind of way where like you, the other person felt that I didn't really love them or I didn't care about the relationship, right? So I made really poor choices and I knew that, but I didn't know why and I didn't know how to stop that from happening.
And when I found the anagram that showed me that my kind of personality, the kind of person that I am runs from things that blew everything right open for me. And it was like that pivotal, pivotal moment in my life where I looked back and I went, wow, like all these men that I heard was because I had just this tremendous fear of working through things and getting past difficult conversations, I didn't know how to emotionally handle that.
So instead of trying to emotionally handle that I would just run. So that's how the anagram got introduced to me. And I think I told absolutely everybody that I knew like you have to go and find out what the anagram type is. You just have to. And I made my husband take the test and I was like, yep, you are absolutely a type five like this just nails you.
But the beautiful thing is that it shows you sort of like you are not so wonderful traits and not to put you in a box. But so that then you can use that and understand that about yourself and then do better and choose better. And the moment I learned that about myself was the moment that I was no longer able to keep doing the same thing because now I knew better.
So now it was on, on me to make a better decision. And so slowly that I, you know, when I found it a couple of years ago, I started implementing that in my marriage and, and I knew, and I will die on the hill with this. I, I don't know if I would be married. Hadn't, I have not found that because I was doing the exact same thing, the same patterns were there. And whenever we would bicker argue, I would leave the room like no joke. I just, I would shut it down.
I, but when I learned it and then I hired my own anagram coach and she really helped me, you know, understand why I was being this way and then how to really express myself, then everything changed. And I was able to have those really hard conversations with my husband and work through things and it saved my marriage. It saved me, a life of pushing people away and ruining relationships. And so now that's what I hope people do.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
so you're, you're giving back what you learned and what essentially a different antia gram coach helped you realize about yourself and giving you the tools and skills to, like, actually make those changes. It sounded like you were just, like, fed up. You did not want to go down that road again of like that running away type of behavior, huh?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah, 100%. It, it was the thing that literally changed it all for me. I knew I would have ended up in the same situation just because you're in a new relationship doesn't mean there go your old habits and patterns you're bringing them with you. And so if you don't even know what those are, but you're seeing the same pattern in the same relationship, then you're the problem, right?
Like, if you're the common denominator, so either do something about it or you're gonna end up alone. Yeah. And I was like, now everyone needs to know about this. Like, how, I don't know how people get through things without really understanding themselves. And so, yeah, that's, that's what led me to start coaching, either individuals or couples and first and foremost is like that foundation of the anagram.
So you even know yourself before you dive into. How do I communicate better with my partner? How do I express myself? Right? All these things, it's like, wait, but first, do you know why you react the way you react? Do you know why you get defensive? Do you know why you shut down? Do you know why you want to walk out of the room? Because if you don't understand why you're even doing it, you can't change it.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. Yeah. It's really hard to understand behavior and do something differently if you're like, well, I just always done it and of course, I'll always do it like this. I don't know any better. One thing that came up for me is there's, there's multiple different engram types. How, how many types are there? Like not to choose from?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
There are 99 and everybody there is and everybody, but this has been studied and researched for years and years and years and there are nine, everyone, has little aspects of all the other types because that's just we're, we're human, right? But there are what's called core motivations. So it's the reasons behind your choices and your decisions that are different for each person.
So like for a type seven, like me, the reason why I might leave a relationship, the way I did is different from someone else. So for me, I'll leave a relationship because I just don't want to deal with the problems. And so I'll just run away because my core motivation is to be happy, right? Is to avoid having to deal with the pain. So where am I gonna be happy? Well, a type seven always thinks the grass is always greener.
So I'm gone. That's my core motivation for leaving a relationship. A type five. For example, like my husband, they might, they might what their motivation might be. I need something stable. So I'm going to leave this relationship because I need stability in my life. Yeah. So every type has a different reason for why they do things and that's really what makes the difference between online.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Can we go over the other numbers? Just for listeners to kind of get an overview? Don't need to do a deep dive but like what, what are the kind of like general characteristics of each number?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah. So a type one are the ones that out of all the types are known to have the hardest time because they have an inner critic in their head. They are the ones that are bashing themselves in their mind like you're not good enough. That wasn't right. You have to do better. So, and they have a very controlling aspect to them primarily based on how they were raised.
These folks are usually in, in a church environment or in a community based environment or a parent that's very overbearing. So that's usually that, well, that is AAA type one. A type two is they're considered the helpers. They, they love to help other people. They are the caretakers, the teachers, the ones that open their hearts to people.
but they get hurt a lot, a lot because they give and give and give and then don't really receive back and then feel as though they aren't really loved and supported by other people. But it's just that they give more than sort of like the average person. A type three. Those are your leaders, those are your CEO S, those are your high achievers. Those are the people who, what they're actually considered chameleons because they're the person that when they walk into a room, they can read
a room and then adapt to what the group needs. So if they're in a very social setting, they'll be more social. If they're like at a, at a book reading club, they'll be quieter, they can adapt. They strive for excellence. Type threes, type fours are the artistic types. These are the ones that go through life, either as musicians or artists in some kind of way.
They're dancers, they are highly emotional and they are the ones that have out of all the types have no problem sitting in their pain like they can be sad for days, but it doesn't bother them they don't have a need to stop feeling that way. They are deep intense feelers. Like they love romantic movies or sad movies. Right. Anything that has real deep human connection.
That's a type four, a type five. Like my husband is methodical. They are researchers, they are intellectual. They are very much in their head. They are planners. They can be messy and disorganized but because they have so much going on in their minds, they really rely on self independence. They like to make sure other people around them are self independent because they don't want to take care of everybody.
They don't have sort of like that energy in them in order to do that. So they really require independent, strong people in their life in order for them to feel secure and safe. That's their sort of need. a type six type sixes. So I'm a seven with a wing of a six. I won't get too far into that. But what that basically means is I lean towards a little bit of a type six.
So type sixes are the most loyal really out of all the types. They will be there for you no matter what, these are your friends that you do something horrible. They're like, I've got you. That's ok. They're also highly indecisive. It is, it, it is an incredible challenge for them to make even the smallest of decisions and they can live in this loop of always needing to make sure that what they're doing is right.
And that is in their own minds where they fail so they can beat themselves up a lot. They have a lot of insecurity about that. They live their life, sort of like in doubt, always in doubt. I mean, even if someone tells them, hey, this is the right answer. You should do this. They're like, but is it really good? Is it? I'm not sure. And so that's kind of like their little thing.
but they are the most loyal and they will always, they'll always be by your side. And then you have a type seven which is my type. We are bubbly and energetic, fiery, very independent, but don't like to feel pain, any kind of argument. We run away from things for the most part. We can be selfish also because the whole thing is for us to feel happy and be ok.
And sometimes that, that's at the detriment of others. So type seven's job is to really try to keep themselves grounded and, you know, focused on what's gonna be good for everyone and not just us individually. Type eight are strong. These are sort of like the rules, they are protectors of their families, their communities, whoever they care about causes, they are big on protection and loyalty as well.
They come off, they can come off brash because they don't tiptoe around things. They're direct. They tell you how it is and you either like them or you don't like them, but type eights are important and they're needed because they're the kind of people who will always stick up for what's right and be the one to tell you or tell others when they're getting out of line.
So, so that's a type eight and then a type nine, type nines are, so they're similar to sixes in the sense that they can be indecisive, but really a type nine does not like to rock the boat in any kind of way. They're super laid back. They have opinions. They just don't voice them because they are, they are, they have conflict aversion so they don't want, they are, they're more the mediators in a group.
If there's two people arguing in front of them, they're gonna step in and mediate the situation, they won't take sides because then that's creating drama, creating a problem and they're here to be laid back and to help everybody and to be the mediator. But they can also come off as a little bit of a pushover because they don't really voice their opinions. But when they do, they blow up because they've been holding it for so long.
But nines are great and they have their strong opinions. They, they just need to exert themselves a little bit more, but they're great mediators. They're the kind of person you want on your team to help diffuse any kind of situation or be the one to think of all the options and then help a team decide.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
I love how you went through each one and you talked about the strengths of each and then also talked about, ok, you know, this is where it kind of like gets them into trouble. So I like how you balance that so nicely. That way. It's like, oh no, there's all this wrong with me. Like there are a lot of strengths with each unique one. So that's really good to know.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah, 100%. Yeah.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
So you know, we're gonna talk about these pillars that you've kind of created as like your three pillars to any happy relationship. And so I, I want you to kind of tell the audience what is this relationship trifecta that you've come up with to be able to help your clients?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah. So I created this really first with my own mayor. I was trying to find a way of in between all the mentors that I have and, and everything that I've learned over the past couple of years, how to really communicate better with my husband. I knew I didn't want to run away anymore. But how do I actually do this? And so when I really sat down and thought about it, I came up with three so basic, when I tell you, you're gonna be like really so basic.
But oftentimes we don't like practice it in the moment that we, we're in the conversation or disagreement. So the three pillars of the relationship trifecta. So, self awareness, right? Everyone's like, obviously you have to be aware. OK? But here's where it really differs, here's where it matters. Not, it's not just being aware of what you're feeling, right?
Because if you're in an argument, you're probably gonna say I'm angry or I'm sad. OK. Fine. Sure. You're angry and you're sad. Ok? But what are you angry about what is the real reason? You're not angry because they didn't wash the dishes? thank you.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Right.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
You're angry. Probably because you feel unheard, you feel underappreciated. Right? Like if you've asked them and they said, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I'll do the dishes and they don't, and you get into an argument over it. You're not mad because they didn't do the dishes. You're mad because you feel like you weren't hurt. Right. You feel like you have to do it all?
So being self-aware is having awareness of what you're actually upset or sad about. It's not the actual circumstance or situation of what you're in. It's the root reason behind it. So that's the very first thing. The second thing then is taking personal responsibility. It's literally telling yourself or asking yourself. Ok. How am I showing up right now?
Am I, you know, something as simple as body cues? Am I waving my finger? Do I have my hand on my hip, right? So we're talking about body cues also. Am I showing up to this conversation? Defensive? What does that look like? Being defensive is when they're explaining to you their side? Like, oh, I forgot or whatever it is that they have to say, then you immediately going. But I told you, right.
You jumping over what they're saying to prove your point to get your point across because if you don't get defensive, then it's almost like what they have to say doesn't trigger you in a deeper way. But you only really get defensive when whatever it is that they said has some truth to it. Oh, but you don't think about that because you're stuck being mad because the dishes weren't done.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Right. Right. So the, the person bringing this up has to do a lot of like, of their own internal work of like, first that awareness. But then also noticing like, what is truly being triggered in them and how might that, like prevent them from even listening to their partner talk about like, what, what the issue is? Wow.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach, Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
So how do you, how do you help the defensiveness again for if they bring something up to you like that?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
So let's say, I'm, talking to my partner and we're talking about an issue and I start to get defensive. Like, what would you tell me as your client?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
I would say? Ok, in the moment you got defensive. What was your main thought about what they said? Is it? Oh, I'm so mad at them because how dare they say that? And I feel disrespected or how dare they say that because they said this numerous times. And now I know deep down maybe there's a little bit of truth and I'm just annoyed and irritated that they brought it up.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
So defensive is like, also what it sounds like a protection mechanism from you doing your own internal, like, oh, what's really being, you know, what's the big pain point here?
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach, Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
And, and so it sounds like you really help your clients, like, do a lot of that inward work of like, ok, let's actually bring that pain to light instead of putting a protective barrier over it that you think is helping the situation when it's really not 100% personal responsibility is the hardest one of the three.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
But it's the one where I truly feel like if everybody took personal responsibility just a little bit, there would be so much less arguing, so many better relationships if everyone just stopped, you know, projecting and said, ok, wait a minute. But like, what am I doing here? Right. How am I showing up? And even, ok, you're angry that they didn't do the dishes and they were supposed to and they had told you that they would, I get it.
But do you need to bring it up in, in, in a not so kind way. Right. How, like, can we take a little personal responsibility of how I'm even talking to this person that I love that I'm choosing to be with over something that's so quote unquote, insignificant as washing dishes because again, it's not about that. It's about how it makes you feel. So, it's just tuning in a little bit to yourself.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. Do you find that there's like a certain Enio gram type that struggles, like more so with defensiveness than others?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Oh, so I would call myself out on that type seven. I was highly defensive and I wanna say victim mentality, but it was very much like I can't be wrong. You're out of your mind, you're wrong. Type ones as well. It's funny because a type seven when they are in their worst sort of state, they jump into type one qualities.
So there's another little thing for you there. Yeah. The type ones can be highly critical and judgmental because they always, not always, but they like to be right. The type of ones also have a hard time with defensiveness.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. Ok. And, and I love this phrase. I've, I've kind of learned it from some other podcasts that it's like if you're wrong and I'm right or if you lose and I win, then we both lose. Like, it's, it, it doesn't help anybody if like one person is supposed to quote, win versus the other.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
So I love Estelle Perrell said, who's one of the mentors said something similar along those lines. She said you can be right or you can be married. Yes.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. Would you rather have a partner and, like, it's ok to be wrong and it's ok to lose in those situations or does your pride mean more to you?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah. And this isn't easy work, you know, it's hard. But if it's something that you really love, I mean, you're gonna do what you're gonna do for the person that you love it. You know, especially if you're done with, with the games and you're done with always with arguing like it, it, it comes down to the point where you realize something has to give, we're not, we're
arguing too much, we're not communicating properly and you know, that that's the issue, then you can't just assume it's them and expect them to change. You also have to change.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
So your, your process, we gain awareness, we start taking personal responsibility during these conflicts and then you mentioned decisions or intention.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach, Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
What, what does that step look like as the trifecta?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah. So that one is in the moment of your conversation right now, you have a choice, right? So what's your intention for even having this conversation? Is it, you know, and that's something that you should know is your intention having this conversation to yell at them and berate them and you know, tell them basically, you see, you never listen to me, this is just how it always is or is your intention to figure out why this happened and how we can then correct it.
So that's why I say intention slash decision because you can make, you can have take the decision to ask them. Ok. It didn't get done. All right. Can we talk about this? Why didn't it get done? Did you forget? Right. But from a place of curiosity, if your intention for this is to resolve it and move on, so everyone can go about their day, then you have to make better decisions and how you wrap up the argument.
And it's always in the light of let's resolve this together. And I talk a lot about the team mentality, right? So it's not have it be me versus you like me versus my husband then versus the dishes. It's like me and my husband versus the dishes. Hm.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
How does that? How does that work when you team up and, and you view whatever the situation as the problem? Like, how, how do you help with that? Like, what does the process look like that's different than we're used to?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Oh, my God. I have so much practice on this because it was my hardest, the hardest thing for me. So it's being open to listening to them without being judgmental, without blaming them without bringing up past issues, even if it's the same exact situation. So it looks like saying, ok, this didn't get done. This is how it makes me feel. It makes me feel like, like you didn't listen to me.
It makes me feel like I'm really being unheard and not valued because if not, I always end up doing the dishes myself. So please tell me why didn't it get done? Is it that you forgot? Is it that you meant to do it? And then you ended up doing something else? Is it that you just didn't want to do it? Like, like help me understand your side in this now and then based on what they say, then that's your opportunity to say, ok, how can we do this better next time?
How can we resolve this? Should we put an alarm on our phone? Should we decide to, you know, that you're gonna do the dishes on a different day and time? is it something that you actually hate doing? This is something that comes up a lot is people assign tasks to other people, but that isn't even something that they're good at. And I'm not saying that everyone has to be good at this, but there are things that one person genuinely hates to do and if that person genuinely hates or doesn't
do a good job or you catch yourself redoing the job that they did, maybe that person shouldn't do that job and they can do something else. So it's just coming to this understanding of, ok, why didn't this happen and let me know and let's, let's decide on what we're going to do next time. So we have kind of more of a plan. So this doesn't happen again or if it does, we already know why it's happening and it doesn't need to become a bigger issue.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Hm. Wow. What, what a process of like, just unraveling and unpacking so many things in these conversations that, that you have about, you know, just trying to approach it differently, trying to approach a problem differently where you're actually working with your partner instead of seeing your partner as the problem.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Exactly. And it gets so much easier, you know, you first think, oh, there's all these steps but it's just to break down what's happening in your mind and how you're feeling. So then you can just articulate it better and it gets so much easier and you can actually do it in real time in the moment of your conversations. That's the point where I am now, where before I go off, I check myself and I'm like, wait a minute.
Ok. Right. Let's ok. Let me be aware here. Ok. Where can I take a little bit of responsibility? Right. For my part of this. And then what do I want, do I want to be arguing about this until we go to bed? No. Right. Ok. So what can I do? What can we talk about to resolve it and move on? It? Really? Does become that simple?
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. What what do you say when you kind of work with clients who may let things just kind of ruin their mood for the day, like you just mentioned, oh, do I want to like argue about this till we go to bed or do I want to like have this tension until you know, whatever different activity is happening? Like what, what do you say to the people who struggle with like holding on to stuff like that? How can they like let go?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
So the very first thing would be to not make yourself wrong for holding on to that because you're holding on to that really? Because you feel like you didn't do a good job or that situation shouldn't have happened. And so you hold it and you hold it thinking that if you keep holding it long enough, it's gonna pass or you can change what happened, right?
You're kind of like cradling it because you feel like it just didn't go, right? And if you, if you keep holding that, there's this saying, I don't know who said it, but it's like if you resist whatever you resist persists and so the longer you stay holding it, it's like you're resisting the reality of what happened and, and that is what it is, it will continue and your, your mood will stay the same and you'll stay all sad and upset about it.
So, you know, really there isn't much that you can do except, except that, yeah, that conversation didn't go. Well, that sucks. But, like, let me evaluate a second. Ok, let me think about it and go. What could I do better next time? Well, first, let me be aware enough. Like, what happened? What did I say? That, that I probably shouldn't have said because it made things worse.
Right. And I always tell people to think about themselves, Like, don't, well, they shouldn't have said that. No, no, no. Let's focus on you. What did I say? What did I do that next time? I would have done differently and appreciate yourself for that part of the growth of being able to recognize. Ok, I know next time I would choose different things to say and appreciate yourself for that and go Yeah. OK. Cool. Now I know what I would have said differently and let yourself feel into that
and let go of what happened and forgive yourself for any part that you didn't like. So that next time, you know, OK, I have a better way of thinking about this and just consider it as another little thing that you've learned. There's gonna be so many opportunities to get to get it right. So just take that as a little lesson learned and now you've grown and now you can do better next time.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. What a, a concept I, I love how you explain this in such like a warm and compassionate way of like, you know, don't look at this as like something you have to let go of like, explore its purpose. What is it doing here? Like, why is it that you're holding on to it and then like, taking it even further and going into this learning point of like, oh, what can I do differently?
How can I grow as a person from this experience? What can this teach me such such an opportunity for growth in so many ways? Love that. Yeah. Hm. You know, I, I was kind of wondering, what, what else do you think that it's really hard for people, like when you're coaching? Because I know we've I've read a bit of your bio and saw that, like, you know, you kind of talked about after years of living in like this victimhood and string of failed relationships.
Like, so I want to go into like this victimhood mentality because I think this affects a lot of relationships of like you did this to me or you're doing this to us rather than the, the looking at the problem as the team as you were talking about earlier. And I'm curious if like, you know it all or if you explore with your clients, where does this victimhood mentality even come from? Like, how does it come out?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Hm. Yep. So I'm going to say really from your upbringing. I can speak for myself in this, my, which you would not think is the case. But I'll explain why. When I was growing up, my parents are still married to this day. They have the best relationship I've seen, in any couple they've been married 40 years or something like that. but they never argued in front of us. So you think that's beautiful? Right. And it is. However growing up, I had an image in my mind that marriages are perfect.
Oh, so wonderful. They never, never argued, bickered, had blowout. Nothing, nothing, nothing. It, to me it was perfection. So when I got into my relationships, I was like, but wait a minute, what we, what we can't be arguing that that means that this isn't right. And so then it became a, well, you're the problem and not me because I come from a great family of happy relationships where they, they don't bicker and argue. I don't bicker and argue. So you're the problem.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
I know how to do relationships. Right. Exactly.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah, exactly. Because I never witnessed that. I never saw anyone apologizing or taking responsibility. So I just always thought, you know, I, I'm not the problem here. Everyone else is the problem. And so I realized, oh, wait a minute, wait a minute. Yes, I actually am the problem. And so I was forced with that mirror, that reality of saying I can't walk around anymore saying that I'm not responsible for anything and that I'm not the problem.
I can't put the blame on anybody else. I have to take responsibility and say, ok, I need to make a change. If not, nothing is ever gonna last in my life. So that's where I see it for me. That's how victimhood plays with me because I was walking around as the victim because I was like, nobody gets me. What is wrong? Why can't I have a great relationship with no issues?
What is wrong as if I was some, like, unique snowflake. Like no one else understands. I guess there are no happy marriages anymore. That was back in the day. Yeah, when that's not reality, the reality at all. And so a lot of clients have, many different upbringings but it really stems from them either the way they perceive the people who took care of them, you know, from, from the way they were acting or it's just things that they picked up along the way
with no really clear guidance and no one really showed them how to properly be in, in conversation with someone. that really leads to them being like victims a lot of the time.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Wow. Oh, my gosh. So really, you kind of use your own process of that, taking responsibility to give yourself a reality check and get out of your victim hood 100%.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
And that, that's like the one thing that I always stand by and it's not to say that other people aren't wrong, right? Like this isn't at all about settling or letting people slide with things that they shouldn't at all. But first and foremost, let's check in with yourself before we then jump into, you know, anyone else's mind and what they're thinking.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Yeah. And I'm glad you made that note about like not letting things slide or letting other people just kind of do this walking all over you. The, the taking responsibility isn't an excuse for those things. I like how you, you phrase that. It's like first just doing your internal, like what are you contributing? And also like recognizing how maybe other people around you can take that responsibility to help the situation?
You know, I I'm curious, are there any other things that we haven't gone over about, you know, kind of incorporating any a gram and your tools as a relationship coach? Anything else specific that like you would like to talk about and give listeners?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Well, for the anagram, I would say if anyone is going to take an assessment to find out the anagram type, whenever they take the assessment, they will probably get four or five types that are most likely theirs. And not to assume that the very first one is their type. It's why I really suggest that someone take an ingram assessment with a certified Engram coach because we have specialized questions that we can ask you to really make sure that, which one of these four is your actual
type. And that's why I said in the beginning that we all have little bits of all types because we're human. And so it's important to not assume that the first one is really their type because then it can sort of like if they're using it to try to do better, it might not resonate with what they're reading and then think, oh, this, this just isn't for me. So if they're not going to hire a coach, that's fine.
But read the first four descriptions in detail and, and then sort of figure out from there which one really lands the most with me and a trick I will offer on that. The one that you feel the most triggered by is most likely your type. The one that you're like, oh, that is a, I don't like that person at all. That's probably your type.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Oh, I love that trick. Yeah. Well, I think that's funny because often the things that, like bring us the most pain or like the things that make us angry or upset is usually something within ourselves that we're insecure about. So I like how you preface that. Yes. Well, it has been so much fun talking with you today and learning about the engram, which is something I'm not very familiar with and I, I learned a lot from it and I think, a lot of listeners are probably ready to take that test
and see what their type is now after having this conversation. Seriously, I'm, I'm super interested in this now. So if people like what you had to say or are interested in working with you, you know, what, what's the best way to find you or get in touch or like find the stuff that you do?
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Yeah. So I primarily hang out on Instagram. It's my place I'm there all day, every day so they can find me. My handle is at Natalia Hernandez coaching. You can find me there or just head to my website Natalia Hernandez coaching dot com. But I would, I would say Instagram. OK.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
Awesome. And just as a special treat for listeners, Natalia has prepared a free guide to let go and move on and a free guide to communicate better and argue less like who the heck would not want those things. So I'll put them in the show notes for everybody to get up on and be able to download those freebies. Thank you so much Natalia for this conversation. I've had so much fun and I'm super excited to hop on your email list.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach, Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
Thanks pa It's been a blast.
Natalia Hernandez, Enneagram + Relationship Coach
I'm, I'm thankful for this opportunity. Yeah.
Paige Bond, Marriage Coach
All right listeners. Until next time. Take care.
